FJRiders.com

You know, I appreciate the empathy....but damn, what has happened to this board? No "DUMBASS!", no Beavis and Butthead "Ha-Ha!", no nothing. And Jasen, if you think that you're EVER going to get out from under that Fork work "cone of shame"...yeah, no.

Just thinking through how this happened, about 2-3 weeks ago I had hoped to change tires on a Saturday so I could ride with Duane on Sunday. I was getting frustrated putting on this rear tire and got pissed and gave up. I usually dont take both tires off at the same time, but I wanted to dismount and mount both tires at the same time for some reason. So after moping for three weeks, yesterday I got after it. I made a mistake by not double checking the setup, so maybe the board had slipped under the center stand, whatever...I did not check it. Also, the previous owner applied a nice slab coating, looks nice but the surface is slightly slipperier than a standard concrete slab. When I went to pull the pumpkin and the splines no issue. When I went to install the acorn nuts on the top to bolts to hold it up I did not have situational awareness as I was sitting on my ass to realize that by pushing the pumpkin against the swingarm, I was pushing the bike forward...and centerstands dont do that and stay up. I must have pushed the bike off the center stand and as the bike went down and forward, the full weight of the bike was supported from the front board under the headers. I know that I yelled as the bike was falling off the stand. I must have instinctively grabbed something as my right forearm and arm near my shoulder have some bruising and a cut. The weight looked to be supported uniformly from the edge of the 2x as there is now a neat shiny 1/4" deep indentation on the header metal.


Im gonna finish balancing the tires, install them and take it out for a spin in the next day or so. We have out of town visitors arriving today...otherwise it would be today.

Dude. You’re injured and therefore not at full strength.

The collective membership is expressing empathy for injuries AND for dumbass events. (Aren’t they related?)

Just so you feel better. "YOUR A DUMB ASS" and now we are even for you tipping my bike over.
I doubt the dent in the header pipes will have any measurable effect on performance.

fjray wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:27 am Just so you feel better. "YOUR A DUMB ASS" and now we are even for you tipping my bike over.
I doubt the dent in the header pipes will have any measurable effect on performance.

Thanks Ray. My guilt is now assuaged....even though I was miles away when your "event" happened.

Thanks for the opinion on the headers as well. So I'm still good up to 155! YES!

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:42 am ...Thanks for the opinion on the headers as well. So I'm still good up to 155! YES!

Well, not quite... The dented headers will increase torque at low RPM, probably not enough to notice without a stopwatch. The dents will decrease torque at higher RPM. Even if you had a baseline at the drag strip to compare against, you probably wouldn't definitively see the decreased power.

Dang. Foiled again.

Fortunately I don’t ride fast like Alan does.

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:22 am You know, I appreciate the empathy....but damn, what has happened to this board? No "DUMBASS!", no Beavis and Butthead "Ha-Ha!", no nothing. And Jasen, if you think that you're EVER going to get out from under that Fork work "cone of shame"...yeah, no.

Yes, but I'm continually being dealt more and more better cards to play.

I was thinking, how the hell did it fall over? It's always very stable on the centerstand...

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:22 am When I went to install the acorn nuts on the top to bolts to hold it up I did not have situational awareness as I was sitting on my ass to realize that by pushing the pumpkin against the swingarm, I was pushing the bike forward...and centerstands dont do that and stay up. I must have pushed the bike off the center stand and as the bike went down and forward, the full weight of the bike was supported from the front board under the headers.

Oh shit, yea, that'd do it. Ouch.

Oh yea, what a dumbass!

Happy now?

Looked at my front Road 5 after a 2,000 mile trip and barely 7K on the tires and am amazed at how fast they toasted during the trip. All the bikes I have ever owned usually wore out the rear first. This bike it has been the front on 2 Michelin sets. I guess that is what mostly 200 mile twisty rides will do to any tire before the 2K Gap area ride ended its life quickly. Thinking my 16 needs a suspension upgrade. Like the 5's so do not blame the tires at all.

^^^^ The FJR can be really hard on both tires, but even the front especially if your riding style is to bring it in hot and brake while leaned over. I did have one front that wore in a similar fashion. I punished it in Arkansas. I have since changed my riding style. I used to stay off the gas while decelerating in the curve. Doing that weighted the front more and didn’t really keep the bike balanced. Very difficult to roll on the throttle mid corner as it would upset the suspension.

Maybe you are not doing that, but it was the cause of mine. Oh yeah, how about stop using those trash PR 5s and get a premium Shinko. Lol.

Blueridgerider wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:08 pm Looked at my front Road 5 after a 2,000 mile trip and barely 7K on the tires and am amazed at how fast they toasted during the trip. All the bikes I have ever owned usually wore out the rear first. This bike it has been the front on 2 Michelin sets. I guess that is what mostly 200 mile twisty rides will do to any tire before the 2K Gap area ride ended its life quickly. Thinking my 16 needs a suspension upgrade. Like the 5's so do not blame the tires at all.

I would either be super pissed that I burned through a tire like that in 2k miles, or have an ear to ear grin for all the fun I had doing that to the tire. Haha. Not sure which yet!

^^^^
It was a 2000 mile trip, but 7000 on the tires. Atleast that's the way I read it.

Dumbass! So how not to Wheaton your FJR with both wheels off..... I don't use any wood under the centerstand, but if you do, use plywood, it's flat. Nice flat jack under the headers. Remove front wheel first and lower the bike, more clearance to get the back wheel off. Can help to position back wheel at back edge of lift, even fancier if you have a removable panel under the back wheel. I have done it many times (no ratchet straps anywhere), but I watch my ass while doing it as all this ain't by anybody's recommended procedure book.
PS - ignore the black things in the photo, I don't use those at all. The red thing is one of the best tools ever and cheap.

raYzerman wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:19 pm Dumbass! So how not to Wheaton your FJR with both wheels off..... I don't use any wood under the centerstand, but if you do, use plywood, it's flat. Nice flat jack under the headers. Remove front wheel first and lower the bike, more clearance to get the back wheel off. Can help to position back wheel at back edge of lift, even fancier if you have a removable panel under the back wheel. I have done it many times (no ratchet straps anywhere), but I watch my ass while doing it as all this ain't by anybody's recommended procedure book.
PS - ignore the black things in the photo, I don't use those at all. The red thing is one of the best tools ever and cheap.

I have that same lift. It is super cool. I have used it flat and with the black spacer thingies. It works really well, both ways. I got it years ago, on sale somewhere. Totally worth whatever I paid for it. The bike is super stable.

Blueridgerider wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:08 pm Looked at my front Road 5 after a 2,000 mile trip and barely 7K on the tires and am amazed at how fast they toasted during the trip. All the bikes I have ever owned usually wore out the rear first. This bike it has been the front on 2 Michelin sets. I guess that is what mostly 200 mile twisty rides will do to any tire before the 2K Gap area ride ended its life quickly. Thinking my 16 needs a suspension upgrade. Like the 5's so do not blame the tires at all.

Got your PM. That tire wear does not look like you have a suspension problem. It's a dual compound (center hard, sides softer). Looks kinda normal for a twisty rider. Your mileage is your mileage for your style, and you know your history from other tires you've had. All you can do is try different tires and see what works for you despite anyone's opinions. Road 5's get mixed reviews. Perhaps go back to a PR4 rear, folks like those a lot and so do I.
You can try a different front, such as Metzeler Z6, but it will wear similarly (I've used many of those on the front). What's better? T31? RSIII will be more neutral in the turn-in department, and you want better turn-in. Try a Shinko Raven 009, my current one (not on an FJR) is wearing really long and evenly. My pressures typically 41-42 front and 42-44 rear, and my tires wear evenly with a mix of highway and twisties.
For front suspension, first thing is new fork springs, the Traxxion spring kit comes with all you need as a plug and play kit, no brainer install for a good price. I would not invest in valving or cartridges until you tried that, with a 7-8 weight fork oil.
Depending on what you weigh, with the OEM Gen3 shock, try SOFT with rebound damping at 6-7 and tweak it as necessary so it isn't bouncy. If you're really aggressive, you might want that at 5. If you're a heavyweight, HARD and back off the damping to 8-9 as that is a ~950 lb. spring on HARD. IF none of that floats your boat, then look for an aftermarket shock. Again, might want to go there before investing in fork cartridges.

Since I work on cars I have jack stands. First I put the center stand down on a piece of 2x6 (after I roll the rear tire onto another piece of 2x6). I put a section of 2x6 on my jack head (the one from the rear tire) and raise the front and remove the wheel. Then I slide a pipe through the forks and lower it back down so that the pipe rests on the jack stand at roughly normal height. I remove the back wheel, slide a small bar through and lower the bike until the bar just rests on the jack stand and leave the jack in place under the headers. Rear wheel goes back on first.

raYzerman wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:49 pm

Blueridgerider wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:08 pm Looked at my front Road 5 after a 2,000 mile trip and barely 7K on the tires and am amazed at how fast they toasted during the trip. All the bikes I have ever owned usually wore out the rear first. This bike it has been the front on 2 Michelin sets. I guess that is what mostly 200 mile twisty rides will do to any tire before the 2K Gap area ride ended its life quickly. Thinking my 16 needs a suspension upgrade. Like the 5's so do not blame the tires at all.

Got your PM. That tire wear does not look like you have a suspension problem. It's a dual compound (center hard, sides softer). Looks kinda normal for a twisty rider. Your mileage is your mileage for your style, and you know your history from other tires you've had. All you can do is try different tires and see what works for you despite anyone's opinions. Road 5's get mixed reviews. Perhaps go back to a PR4 rear, folks like those a lot and so do I.
You can try a different front, such as Metzeler Z6, but it will wear similarly (I've used many of those on the front). What's better? T31? RSIII will be more neutral in the turn-in department, and you want better turn-in. Try a Shinko Raven 009, my current one (not on an FJR) is wearing really long and evenly. My pressures typically 41-42 front and 42-44 rear, and my tires wear evenly with a mix of highway and twisties.
For front suspension, first thing is new fork springs, the Traxxion spring kit comes with all you need as a plug and play kit, no brainer install for a good price. I would not invest in valving or cartridges until you tried that, with a 7-8 weight fork oil.
Depending on what you weigh, with the OEM Gen3 shock, try SOFT with rebound damping at 6-7 and tweak it as necessary so it isn't bouncy. If you're really aggressive, you might want that at 5. If you're a heavyweight, HARD and back off the damping to 8-9 as that is a ~950 lb. spring on HARD. IF none of that floats your boat, then look for an aftermarket shock. Again, might want to go there before investing in fork cartridges.

Thanks Ray and to all who responded. I will try a different tire this time around as I already have not had great experiences with both the PR4's and R5's. I have owned a fair amount of motorcycles over the years and have never worn fronts like this. I did move from the flatlands of the Va Beach area to the twisties of SC/WNC. Duh!! As no doubt 11 curves in 318 miles in Va beach to mostly all curves where I ride now is the difference. I will gladly put new tires on my bike here more often as I ain't going back there Might try Shinko this time. Something with a better balance of grip and wear. The R5's feel very sticky, bald but sticky on the outside for sure now and do not feel like higher mileage tires.

Another huge difference with the FJR (at least mine) over all other bikes I have owned is how after a couple thousand miles on new tires it becomes harder to lean. You really have to push my bike as it just does not lean into turns without effort. It feels like it wants to upright itself in turns. My friend who went on this trip with me just bought a Triumph Trophy and we switched bikes. Its no FJR by any means with less power, more vibration, and the brakes do not feel as powerful. They put a lot if their money into electronic gadgetry which acted up over the 2K mikes. Engine lights coming on etc. They discontinued it but it does lean effortlessly into corners, much better than my FJR. I would describe it as it "Falls" into corners where I have to push the FJR and it seems to fight me. With new rubber my FJR is great but looses it quickly with tire wear.

Is this my bikes behavior or an FJR behavior? I had Traxxion on my 08 Wing and now my 17 Z900. On the Wing it made a huge difference in handling. The Wing always fell into corners without much effort after that Mega Monty upgrade. Of course the weight of that bike helped there as well but there was no fight. I would think a Traxxion upgrade might help here? If it is an inherent FJR thing than what if anything would improve it? I really would appreciate any further advice on this.

1. Yesterday, I mounted my new RS3's on my bike. Both were removed from the chassis, and I lived to tell about it. I definitely prefer to do one at a time.

2. Wheatie - for the record, you sir are a dumbass.

3. I see more evidence that the Road 5 is not the tire for me on the FJR. Too much money, too soft rubber.

That is all.

Amount and type of Tire wear is everything to do with How a bike falls into the corner. The effects on tire wear are riding style, type of road surface, right wrist, twistiness of roads, and the tire you are using. It is not an FJR problem, it is a weight, acceleration, tire material, and rider perception issue. I had a PR2 front that absolutely Sucked. I have other tires that don’t fall in as easily at the beginning but the tire profile does not change much over the course of its life.

Oh, and Pants, couldn’t that have just been an unofficial “dumbass”? I don’t want to have to fill out a shit ton of paperwork.

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:23 pm Amount and type of Tire wear is everything to do with How a bike falls into the corner. The effects on tire wear are riding style, type of road surface, right wrist, twistiness of roads, and the tire you are using. It is not an FJR problem, it is a weight, acceleration, tire material, and rider perception issue. I had a PR2 front that absolutely Sucked. I have other tires that don’t fall in as easily at the beginning but the tire profile does not change much over the course of its life.

Oh, and Pants, couldn’t that have just been an unofficial “dumbass”? I don’t want to have to fill out a shit ton of paperwork.

Hmmm Wheaton I won't call you anything official or unofficial and am not going to disagree too much with you as that is too much work I have owned and ridden many motorcycles and its not a perception thing. The handling of this bike sucks on all the 3 sets of tires I have used after a couple thousand miles of use since I bought it. I am talking about hard mountain riding usually 200 mile loops where you have to manhandle the bike to get it into the tight turns. Ok, maybe "Fall" into turns was not the best description of what I expect this bike to do but the bike with normal counters steering it should go into turns much easier than mine. Don't get me wrong, I love the bike for many reasons and hope its the last bike I own. Given that, I want to make it the best it can be and am looking for a way to improve it which is why I take the time to reach out here for advice and others experiences.

I really do not think you can broad brush it as not an FJR problem, just like the wobble issues that I had to install tapered bearings to cure. Some experience the problem, others say no issue but for some like me when I first bought the bike it was a huge PIA as it was unacceptable. Tapered bearings cured it for me. Maybe the tapered bearings are masking a bigger issue with my bike. I want to find out and am hoping to find the cause and someway to improve the handling, simple as that. Might not be an issue for you, is for me. Maybe something is not right with my bike in particular but its not perception, its fact from experience.

So I am in the market for new rubber. All 3 sets have been Michelin so far and you mentioned tires you owned where the profile does not change much. I certainly would be happy if I found a tire that did not change for more miles as that would be a start at delaying the issue. Any suggestions? Appreciate your input, Thanks

Front tire comment only: The tire whose soul benefit is that it kept its profile uniform through its life was a Bridgestone T30 or T31 front. I love For mountain riding Michelin Pilot Powers if it is dry. They don’t last but they stick.

Btw, I was not stating that YOUR perception was wrong, just that perception is a variable.

But don’t take my word for it
-Unofficial Dumbass of Greenville County, “Red”